Excommunication for being gay

     The 'Y' in Women- Political Separatism?

     I think I'm a lesbian but not quite sure

     What about the one about Eternal Salvation?

     I very much miss church

     Lesbian and Mormon: Is is easy to find others to date and have a relationship with?

     How do you keep from falling in love with someone?

     Hope

     Lesbian & Religion

     Living Lesbian, Mormon and Free

     Is the Mormon Church an Abusive Relationship?

     My Mormon Girlfriend

     Lesbians Married to Men

     In Need of Help

     Family Divided

     Sister of Converts to Mormonism

     Old and still confused

     Lesbian Dreams

     "Love and Acceptance?" Where?

     Temple Secrets

     Transgender

     Baptism for Children of Lesbian Mothers

Entries

Excommunication for being gay
I was excommunicated for being a lesbian in 1988. I was raised in a Mormon family and graduated from BYU, but I'd already left the church for all practical purposes three years before, as soon as I had my diploma from the Y. Since then, the only time I have set foot in a church was for my father's funeral.
Do I miss it? Not really. For the first three or four years, it was an issue. Now it's only relevant as a cultural background issue. Many people are shocked and sometimes react negatively if they learn I was raised Mormon.
So, what does all this mean? I'm not sure.

I came out approx. 9 years ago. I asked that my name be removed from church records as I did not want to be hypocritical by living two different sets of values. I believe that what I did was favorable to our Lord. Although it has not been recognized as being acceptable within the church (and may not be for some time) the Lord is pleased with my desire to live my life as an LDS person as best I can outside the confines of the church. My testimony of the truthfulness of the gospel of Jesus Christ has in no way been marred - and oft times actually strengthened. I believe that there will come a day when the Lord will provide terms that we can all live under, but until that day, He expects us to live the best we can, with the knowledge we have. I am proud to have been LDS (and still very much consider myself LDS in beliefs) but I also have a wonderful partner whom I love, and I am proud also to be a lesbian. Marie

Marie,
Thanks for sharing your experience. It is wonderful to hear that there are women out there who have not totally divorced themselves from their testimonies of the truthfulness of the gospel of Jesus Christ. I too have a testimony and must say that your message is a refreshing change from what many lesbian Mormons believe. There are so many women who have become womyn so as not to have ANYTHING to do with men. They have left the church, and gladly, because of the patriarchy. I for one am glad to have every single man that is in my life there. Many of my dearest friends are men. Over the years I have been told by other lesbians that I have too many male friends. I found this so interesting. I consider myself having friends. I never have been the type to categorize my friends by gender, race, physical appearance or anything for that matter. I would like to think that we all can be open-minded enough to simply have friends and not keep a running tally and categorize them.
Tere

The 'Y' in Women- Political Separatism?
The use of this spelling sends a clear message of "Feminist Separatism." I'm curious how this political agenda fits in with the overall goals and mission of Affirmation, a group that purports inclusion and support for all.

Dear Anonymous,
I cannot agree more with what you have said. I do not know the answer to your question, though I have been involved in Affirmation since 1992. I never have been separatist myself, as you can see from my previous message regarding Excommunication for being gay. Thank you for expressing your thoughts, it's nice to know I'm not the only one who thinks that way. I'm anxious to see how others respond.
Tere

Just a comment about the spelling of womyn. To me it sends a clear message of inclusion and support, as Lesbians all over the world have adopted this alternative spelling. It's similar to "grrl" and other nicknames we give ourselves to affirm our membership in this unique community. While the terms may have had a different connotation in the 1970s, today's Lesbians are reclaiming "womyn" and "womon" as terms of empowerment. It is a very appropriate choice for naming this forum.

I think I'm a lesbian but not quite sure
I have had these thoughts of women and I like what I feel and I have a desire to know more of what I should do.

Oh, how I've struggled with this. I have always felt a special connection with other women. It all came to a head earlier this year. After suffering with multiple disabilities and treatments for over six years I finally got suicidal. Through more therapy we got around to sex. I admitted that I hate it. I am married to a man whose life is centered around sex, or lack thereof. I have felt badly for him, and confused about my own lack of interest, for the 16 years that we've been together. I was also sexually abused as a child for 7 years by a stepfather. The therapist asked about fantasies - I don't have any. She then asked about exotic dreams. It was so hard for me to admit that I have had three exotic dreams, all of which involved women, with no men. As I was going through this process of trying to get in touch with ME and MY sexuality, Lesbianism seemed right. I felt like I had come home. I have been to several Lesbian meetings, and have enlisted the aid of a Lesbian therapist for additional discussion. I am so comfortable around women. When I see a woman that is dressed provocatively sexy, I get aroused. I have for years in fact, but have suppressed it. Thinking of having sex with a woman is quite a bit less scary for me than thinking of appeasing my husband. I so very much want to know what it's like to look forward and enjoy sex. Then there's the issue of my daughter and my husband. Do I tell, do I not? Most of the time I feel like he would understand, and I know my daughter would. My youngest sister is gay and has been a wonderful support for me. She was a bit shocked because as she put it "You and Paul did everything right." And we did. We had a 2 year engagement, we didn't move in together until we were married, we waited three years before having our daughter, etc... This leads me to believe that my yearnings are not by choice, yet I recognize that if anybody could be 'made' gay, it would be me. I've come close to being raped several times in my teenage years, and I feel like a tool for my husbands 'fun'.

I'm writing because I feel the same way as the topic's original author. I'm a wife and mother active in the LDS church. I believe in the "male-female marriage" so that we can multiply and replenish the Earth. However, I don't see how any women can live without girlfriends. I am completely hidden in the closet, probably with woolen blankets thrown over me. I am not ready to come out, if ever. Though I do look forward to the day I meet a gal that will return a loving friendship. I have been raised a "tomboy" along with a twin brother. I am eagerly awaiting a pen-pal to discuss the issues of LDS wives and mothers with lesbian tendencies.

What about the one about Eternal Salvation?
What about the one about Eternal Salvation? I mean, that is a fairly tough topic. To me it's been the impetus for trying to come to some type of resolution about this bad predicament we seem to be in. When the Church says I am engaging in a sin comparable to murder I fear—but yet I wonder—Can such love be so Bad? Is Christ the lover of man or the punisher of man?

I am praying to know the God of Love, not the God of pain, and hurt. When one really loves Jesus, isn't that really kind of sick? I have to PRAY to KNOW the God of LOVE? I do think this is a sad state.

I have struggled for years with my sexuality, since a very young girl. Was I Wrong at 3 yrs. old? I loved women even then.

If any one wants to contact me through my email address I will send them a further discussion about the new studies being done in CA. —30% of pregnant women's amniotic fluid had PCB & DDT, carcinogens and pesticides, strong enough to chemically castrate a male, and to prevent a woman from being feminized.

What further proof does the Church need or we need to believe it is definitely genetic—I mean, 30%, imagine that. WOW.

Please respond and write to me anybody, as the chat capacity is not enabled, yet. THANX,
Deb Chi Ann

Hi, I'm a bisexual female. Right now I am in a relationship with a wonderful woman and we are both in love and I have even considered (strongly) marrying her. My problem lies in how I can keep my beliefs/covenants and still maintain a relationship with this woman without having eternal repercussions?

Here it is, Sunday night, & I didn't go to church again; I very much miss it.
I miss Church so much, I have people there that really like me & think I am so spiritual, yet they have never even called me personally, ever since I have reinvestigated after being excommunicated for bisexuality 20 years ago. If these people (our people) think so well of me & I am so spiritual, why don't they call? I don't know what good it would do, I told the best of them that I am lesbian & have been involved w/a woman for 4 some years, I said it was hard to quit being in a loving relationship. They have never contacted me since, for ANYTHING, not even a hello. I am sure Jesus Christ must be hurting at the coolness they have exhibited not only to me but to many others. A month ago, from June, 99, I was praying for the love of God, to know it, to feel it. Is this not sad? Wasn't always Jesus about love? Oh, I hurt so! I have told my Bishop, a very good man, that there is too much pain, Too Much Pain, involved, and how this is very hard to reconcile this with Christ. What is happening here and why? How have you others dealt with this? I really would like to hear other people's hearts and your heart. Share with me, Please.
Deb Chi Ann, Rock Island, Illinois. : (

I wish there were easy answers to this one. It is often just as hard for members to reach out to people in situations that they don't understand as it is for you to reach out to them. For both people it is a risk. For you, the risk is very great of rejection, for them the risk is questioning their beliefs and how they feel about them. The only thing I can say is that I personally have never found any good coming from harboring negative feelings for anyone, for any reason. If you have the strength to, reach out to them, call them, invite them to come visit teach you or have lunch with you. Sometimes the fear of otherness fades as they get to know you outside of the church. If the fear of rejection is too great, just forgive them... Always, always forgive them. San Diego, CA

Lesbian and Mormon: Is is easy to find others to date and have a relationship with?
Being a lesbian and Mormon comes with challenges. The morals and values taught over the years has made it more difficult in finding a relationship today. Where do we find others with the morals and values we have been taught?

I would suggest as a start that you have already done one thing - interact with Affirmation. Find a chapter nearest you and join, attend the Cornerstones and Annual conferences, and start networking. You can always put ads in your local alternative newspaper advertising those qualities. You'll have to put yourself out there so others can find you. Good luck.

How do you keep from falling in love with someone?
I have always been very attracted to women, and it was never a problem. I was always able to separate myself from them enough to keep my heart safe. Until recently, when I find that I have fallen in love with one. I am not sure how to handle this because I have never had this happen before. She is a good friend, and has no idea that I have these feelings, nor would she return them. But I find that I have become very distracted by thoughts of her, and I can't stop. I don't want to hurt our friendship by scaring her away, yet it's very hard to be with her and not want to "be with her."

I have been through a terrible summer where my best friend and I finally talked about the feelings we have had for each other for the past 8 years. We will never recover the friendship. We are both married and have had an amazing relationship for all these years. It will now never be the same. She has chosen her marriage over me (and I do not fault her for this) but we have found we cannot be friends anymore. I don't know if this will be forever, but we can't be friends right now. It is too hard to be around each other now knowing how the other feels. Her husband is very damaged and will probably take a very long time to trust her again. I went to a counselor to try to get a grip and she gave me a wonderful insight that I would like to share with you. I was asking her how in the world I was ever going to get this sick sad feeling out of my gut. I hurt all the time and I was thinking I would never never be able to pull myself out. She asked me if I had ever heard people who used drugs or alcohol "relive the glory days." You know when everyone sits around saying "I was so ripped that....blah, blah blah..." Have you noticed that they smile, laugh, revel in the remembered feelings... Then she said to me "When you talk about this woman, you have that same expression, that same aura." I was really angry with her for using this analogy. How dare she liken my love for this woman to a drug. Later as I have thought about this exchange, I have come to appreciate what she was trying to tell me. I stopped dwelling on the past. I stopped putting her in ALL my thoughts. I stopped listening to the radio for a while because every song would remind me of her. I stopped "reliving the glory days." Even though I still think it was harsh for this counselor to say that to me, it was probably the one thing that helped me heal the most. I now wish we had kept our feelings to ourselves. I have lost the best friend I will ever have, and I am also afraid of ever getting that close to anyone again. But time will tell. I always wondered what our future would be if I did tell her I loved her and now I know. It is not the ending I wanted but it is an ending. I never have to sit with her again, wanting to tell her things and dying inside because I couldn't. It is a bit more honest. I have no idea if this will help, but it's just another story from the naked city!

Hope
Having never submitted something to a forum like this, I'm not totally sure what is appropriate, but I think I have something positive to add. Being in every way possible on the fringes of Mormon society, I have still never once doubted my testimony. The single most hopeful piece of Mormon Doctrine for me is the 14th article of faith. I can't remember it all here but some parts of it are burned into my mind always, especially the line "We believe all things, we hope all things, we have endured many things and hope to endure all things" and of course "If there is anything lovely, praiseworthy or of good report, we seek after these things" (Not quoted exactly) Someone once told me that if the church is all truth, than everything that is true must be part of the church, no matter where it comes from. Never forget that two thirds of the book of Mormon was never translated, and somewhere in there may be the answers for those of differing sexual orientations, those who desire greater knowledge of the Goddess, our mother, an explanation of the whole plural marriage thing, answers for why a church we so strongly feel is true seems now to our poor minds to be so off track. The one thing we must never doubt is the truthfulness of our own personal revelations. If we believe like a little child in what we feel, God will guide and protect us. (I hope that didn't sound too "high falutin" I can get preachy sometimes). San Jose CA

Lesbian & Religion
I was excommunicated 12 years ago, but I had serious doubts about the church, god, the role of women, etc. long before that. Those issues have nothing to do with me being lesbian. I think I'd have left the church eventually anyway.
Leaving the church was a huge issue for me for the first three or four years. I was going to loose my eternal salvation and all that stuff. Then I realized, I had no desire to spend eternity as a baby factory for some guy who thinks he's god. My sister has that and she hasn't even died yet!
I also am not comfortable with a male god, for a variety or reasons. If Mormonism had the courage to recognize the Heavenly Mother that the theology so clearly refers to, I might have been more inclined to stay.
Also, many of the Mormons who were judgmental of me were no better than I was. My bro-in-law makes jibes constantly, but he once emptied his children's bank accounts so he could continue hitting titty bars. He thinks he's better than me, though.
At this point, I'm not sure I believe in a god at all, but if there is one, I think mine would have to be a woman.
I attend a Christian gay church, but I don't believe what they believe. That can be awkward, but they (logically) assume I do. Still, it is a great way to connect with the gay community. —jj--phoenix

I have read all of the topics and to my surprise more or less there was always this big belief inside of the church. I'm amazed how one can't let go of it... And somehow (without judging anybody), one can't break through and accept whoever they are!

I am a return missionary (!!!) and haven't gone to church for 10 years and have learned a lot of what the church concerns. But today I simply don't need the church in my life anymore: I don't feel guilty about, I don't miss it, I don't want to go back to an institution (any) that doesn't allow the beauty of a woman to enter. By all means, even then, I don't think I would want to enter. After having realized the wonders of womanhood, I didn't have to think of why's and because's. —G. from Spain and Switzerland

About 4 years ago, I made the powerful most revealing decision to come out of the closet. It was an extraordinary thing, that I will never forget. Being from a different Religious Background, (First born into and raised up in the Protestant Lutheran Faith, than converted to the Baptist Faith, and lately found the Unitarian Universalists, my final stage of spiritual being) I know what my LDS brother's , sister's go through. I believe in a Loving God who loves every one despite who he/she is. Being a Lesbian, and a Spiritual human being, I think our Christian folks ought to be ashamed to be such hypocrites. The preaching of Christ are Loving, Caring, Sympathetic to the Human Kind. I feel loved by my God and by my creator whether I am a Lesbian, A Heterosexual, a Bisexual or whatever sexual orientation I am coming from. I celebrate the Gift he has given me of being a Lesbian. Being there as a natural icon and sometimes a thorn in the eyes of those who call them self Christian's. I don't want to spread Hate for I do not hate. The point I am making is this every religion does not accept homosexuality. Telling false lies about us. And calling this in the name of God. I found Affirmation two years ago. It has brought me joy, love, support from my friends here in Utah. I thank Affirmation for being there, stretching out their arms to a Non-LDS member. Thank you to all of you. Feel free to Experience your True very Real humanity. Blessings from Angelika ( Germany, Utah, USA)

Hi Folks,
Well I still go out to Church and our dear friend Colley (who is also on the lds-l email list) and I have said several times that for some of us, our mission here in this life is to work from the inside of the Church structure. I got my call last night from my new visiting teaching companion who asked if I would prepare this months lesson. Well it is on Feasting on the word of Christ. I see this way as a perfect opportunity to teach fellow members that they should be more Christlike in their dealings with their Lesbian and Gay Sisters and Brothers. This is my opportunity to teach them that our Savior and our Heavenly Father would not ignore us, or that their love for us is unconditional, and as members of His church they are supposed to be striving to be more like Him.
Well that was my two cents worth...
My Love to all my Sisters and Brothers.
Mary E.

My Sisters :-)
I am a lesbian and also a member (active) of the church. I want to give you a picture of me, and why I describe my message as hopeful. I am a recovering alcoholic, drug addict and self-mutilator! And have been suicidal, acted upon it, and suffered the shame,guilt and pain as all LDS homosexuals and non-LDS/religious ones do too. I've been raised in the gospel, of course baptized. But for three years of my life, I wasn't active and became involved with gay rights/movements/protests etc., the gay scene, many relationships and thus being a proud lesbo, being out to everyone who knew me. I don't fit the stereotype b/c I'm femme so no-one believed me until I brought girlfriends home instead of boyfriends! Now, I'm on the young women's presidency of my country and have extra little callings and activities to run in the church here.
I'm sure your response will be I have been brainwashed (lack of a better word) or kinda hoping for something in my youth that will never happen. But I can honestly say to you, it's not false hope. From all that I have described, do you think I was seeking religion again, or to humble myself in something I didn't agree to? The power of prayer led me to this point and many blessings I have received. I had a choice to make, (and I was supported by everyone, luckily whichever one I chose) whether I was to believe in this church, and EVERYTHING it stood for; to prophets counsel, j.smith interp./transl. of the Bible and so forth, or to; abandon my membership in the gospel and carry on being the most popular lipstick lesbian in my community! I chose God. Because I believed this gospel was true. I didn't just take parts I liked and led my life/decisions by them, I accepted it all. I opened my mind and allowed God to change me. I begged him to mold me into his desired, perfect daughter, the daughter he wanted me to return to him as. Slowly but surely, I am changing. I'm still attracted to women, and some days I just let off steam and breakdown cus it's so difficult, but for the first time ever, I'm thinking about temple marriage and having a husband. For myself, and all that have seen my truest conversion, they've seen God work miracles in me. I don't condemn you, I don't say that you haven't done all you can or anything like that. I love you, and I understand you completely.
One question I used to ask was, 'what if when I see my God and he tells me it was okay to be gay and I either spent all of my life being someone I'm not or I end my life because of it?'. Then the answer came, 'what if when you see him and he asks you why you didn't try ALL that you could. why didn't you believe in my gospel, for I gave you the leaders and counselors to guide you, and through the mouth of my servants, it's even as I. You knew the gospel was true but you chose your own ideals, and didn't believe in my power to change you!'. Sisters, this is not false hope. At many times I've wanted to walk away, but heavenly father has kept me this long, and I think he's trying to tell me something! This is my favourite scripture; ' And God saw that they were good, and he stood in the midst of them, and he said,: These I will make my rulers; for he stood among those that were spirits, and he saw that they were good; and he said unto me: '', thou art one of them; thou wast chosen before thou wast born'.....'And we will PROVE them herewith, to see if they WILL DO ALL THINGS THAT THE LORD THEIR GOD SHALL COMMAND THEM'. You are the choice/chosen children of God and I know this suffering is for a wiser purpose, unknown to me, but you must be very special to you father in heaven if Satan does all he can to take you from the lord YOUR God. He loves you, and I'm thinking of you girls. With all my love xxx —Anonymous

Living Lesbian, Mormon and Free
Hello, my name is Debbie and I was born and raised in the church. Well, sort of. My father was not an active member, but since I lived with other family members, like my grandma and aunt and uncle much of the time, I was going to church off and on throughout my childhood.

Hence, I was baptized when I was 8 years old. The experience was really funny actually; my grandma made me a white dress on her own sewing machine, got me some white booties. My grandpa was going to dunk me, and bless my grandma's heart -- she didn't realize this until the day of the baptism -- but when I walked into the water, my dress floated! I was so embarrassed...and couldn't wait for it to be over! I still remember my grandma standing there, aghast!

One thing that stuck with me about that experience was my ride home from the baptism. My aunt said, "Just think, Debbie, if you never sin again, you might make it to the Celestial Kingdom." This is the sort of mentality that I grew up with. This is the sort of mentality that many of us grow up with, though maybe not all of us.

I came to terms with my attraction to women when I was 18 years old. I will never forget the experience. I was living in Idaho at the time and attending RICKS college. After falling in love with my best friend, I told my counselor about the "thoughts" I was having of kissing her. My counselor's response: "Its ok to have the thoughts, but not OK to act on them." I didn't feel supported with this approach and went through a time when all I wanted was to die. Though I believe my desire to die stemmed from multiple reasons, I believe a big chunk of that desire stemmed from knowing I was a lesbian; and feeling like God hated me, the church hated me, my family hated me, the world hated me and worst of all, I hated me.

I went through approximately two years of wanting to die and of physically mutilating myself. I met a few good people along the way that helped me, a couple of which were Mormons and related to the gay/lesbian experience in some way. These people were a great help to me and helped sustain my life in some ways for me to one day move past the pain and self-destruction into peace, healing and learning how to love myself.

During this time, a couple who had had a son who was gay, told me: "Its not WHAT you are that matters; but HOW you are." This one comment changed my perception in a lot of ways. Up until that point, I had seen my experience from WHAT I am. It hit me over the head like a two-by-four, and believe it was a catalyst for a major shift of thinking for me.

I still had a long road ahead of me, though. I eventually became inactive in the church and active in lesbian activities. I started meeting other women and getting to know the lesbian culture. But I felt like I was between a rock and a hard place because in the Mormon culture I felt like an outcast being a lesbian; and in the lesbian culture, I felt like an outcast being Mormon.

Affirmation provided a place for me to weave the two cultures together. It is one place where I can really "BE" and feel like people know me and understand me because they are much like me. Often, we grew up with similar belief systems, values, ethics, and ways of thinking -- whether harmful or not -- and can relate to each other very well.

At present, I have been excommunicated but still define myself Mormon in a cultural context. I asked to be removed from the records because I felt I could not be a member of a church whose views differed from mine. It would be like being a member of the Republican Party when I'm really a Democrat. I do want to find a woman partner that I am compatible with. And, I have done more than survived; I am living a very happy, peaceful life inside myself.

So, yes, living lesbian, Mormon AND free is possible. You know what else? Despite my aunt's well-intended admonition, I think I have a good shot at the Celestial Kingdom, too! --Debbie

Is the Mormon Church an Abusive Relationship?
Dear Friends, I know this title may sound harsh but I would like you to ask yourself a few questions. Does the church make you feel bad about yourself? Do you fear that because you are a lesbian you will not have the success or happiness that "worthy" heterosexuals enjoy? Will you only feel truly fulfilled by keeping your ties to the church? If you answered yes to any of these questions read on! I was raised in the church, went to B.Y.U., and realized I was a lesbian. I chose to follow my heart and I am presently in an amazing relationship with an intelligent, beautiful woman. We are extremely happy, working on our education (she's in Law School, and I'm getting my Masters in Education) and we hope to start a family when we finish school. Don't let anyone tell you that you cannot be fulfilled, cannot find true love, or cannot be blessed as a homosexual. (After reading this are you saying to yourself "Oh sure, her relationship won't last..." or "she may think she's happy now but..." If these ideas popped into your head, than you may be brainwashed into thinking that gay people cannot be or do not deserve happiness. If you are comfortable and secure with who you are, and make honest healthy choices in your life, you can have everything your heart desires, despite what others would like you to believe. In an abusive relationship, the abuser will first destroy your self esteem, your confidence, and your ability to form bonds with others. This will make you totally dependent on the abuser and they will control you. If you are in a relationship where someone or SOMETHING controls how you feel about yourself, and controls the choices you make in life... GET OUT!

Probably - yes. I've been in the church for 12 years. I have seen it fail my family and I numerous times. I have seen clicks that I do not fit in, but at some points did. I have carried my husbands callings, until I said 'enough'! I view it as a church for the exaltation of men, which I loath! Humanity used to be a matriarchal society, until the good 'men' turned it into a patriarchal society. Look at the history of Jews. Only men could enter certain places in the temple. Sound familiar to modern day LDS? Only men could hold important offices. Women were given less important things to do, and treated like property or a child. No, I'm not active anymore. I still believe in the vast majority of the teachings of the church, but I no longer want to be in a male dominated exaltation of maleness. Women have as much, and I think more, to offer the world than do men. We are compassionate, nurturing, responsible, sensitive to others, etc... Not at all like our exalted counterparts - men! So I say 'go and be exalted but I choose to do things in my life that feel right in my heart. After all isn't that what the missionary lessons teach us about conversion - ask yourself "does it feel right?"

My Mormon Girlfriend
Hi, I have been dating a Mormon woman for almost 4 months now and she is so scared about being excommunicated. She believes that when this happens, the Holy Ghost will leave her and when she dies, she will not be able to be with her children or myself either. I am confused, as I am not a Mormon and do not understand any of this. Could someone help me out here? I am madly in love with her, but her religion is starting to come between us at times.

Hello all. I am a 20 yr old lesbian. Not Mormon, but the girl I love is. She loves me too, very much. She has often said if I was a boy we'd be married by now. Of course I would have to be Mormon too. She and I broke up in February when she moved to Utah to live with her sister for a bit. It was horrible for the both of us, here she found the love of a lifetime, and she chose to give it up, to "sacrifice" the person she loves most for her church, to do what's "right." She is convinced she will marry a boy, have a bunch of kids, and live happily ever after. To her misfortune she is repulsed by men. She once told me she could not even see herself holding a guys hand or hugging, like her and I do. I honestly feel bad for her. Her life would be so easy if she could love a man, and fit into the Mormon mold, but that isn't her. But two months after moving to Utah and breaking up with me, she was back, and we were back together, more in love than ever. Then, in August of this year, it happened again, but I was the one to end it. After learning that my sister was baptized Mormon, and having my girlfriend defend my sisters actions, I realized I wasn't what she wanted, she wanted that husband and the kids, and I respected that, so I broke up with her, because she was too weak to do it. This has been a true test of my strength, I love this girl more than anything, but her religion is tearing us apart. With all due respect, I am not here to bash the LDS faith, but I certainly have a right to my opinion, and I don't believe in it one bit. I've seen the horrible stress she has been put through. If there was only a way she could be happy, have her faith and me. If you could give me any suggestions as to how to help her, to understand being gay isn't this horrible thing, this "handicap" as the church has taught her. I would never ask her to give up her faith, I just know we both make her happy, so I want her to be able to have both. Thank you.

To "My Mormon girlfriend" - the young lady must find the strength within herself to accept her sexuality and expect others to respect her decision to stop pretending to be heterosexual. I was a member for 30 years, married in the temple, a single parent, and 40 years old before I finally realized I was not an abomination in the eyes of my father in heaven. He loves me and I have a place in his plan. I know this with all my heart, mind, and soul. It took 15 years for me to reconnect with the love of my life. I thank god she still loved me and for the last 7 years we've been together. I believe she is my eternal companion. Be patient and understanding. The hell your friend is going through is worse that you could ever imagine. But, given enough time and love she too may become "a recovering heterosexual." —Mary

Lesbians Married to Men
I have known most of my life that I am a lesbian, but chose to marry and have a child in order to be "normal". Now, 31 years later, I find that for many reasons, divorce is a real possibility. I am terrified of what will happen when this occurs. Do I stay celibate the rest of my life so I can remain in "good standing" and keep my temple recommend and church membership or do I stop hiding and live the life I truly believe I was born to.

I find it interesting that in my P. Blessing it states that all of my callings will be working with the women in the Relief Society. In over 30 years of membership, I have never been asked to accept any other type of calling, yet for almost all of those years I have worked with my sisters both on the ward and stake level.

The church has always been a support for me and I love the gospel. I cannot see my life without it.

What will people think? Will I be abandoned both for being divorced and a lesbian? No more callings - akin to living on the fringes and not being able to fully participate? How will I explain that I am not interested in joining the singles groups, or participate in any of their activities if I chose not to divulge my secret?

How will I tell my son and daughter-in-law who are very active and co teach Gospel Doctrines in their ward? I know they are not comfortable with the subject.

I am also mourning the eventual loss of my marriage. I truly love my husband, although I have never been able to be everything to him - especially in the bedroom. And never can be. I know that this has been a disappointment for him and has caused untold problems in our marriage over the years.

So many questions - and fears. Still I feel my Heavenly Father's love for me in so many ways. I do not feel out of place in the temple nor do I feel guilty for going. Whenever I pray in the temple about my concerns, I only feel a deep peace that all will be right.

I've recently acknowledged my lesbianism. I've been married for nearly 15 years to the same man, and have a wonderful daughter. Now I know why I could never really be the person that he needs, wants, or who meets his 'helpmate' roll as the church defines it. I'm afraid, but yet I know that I must live with integrity and tell him soon. There are so many reasons for divorce over and beyond this issue, but should he choose to divorce me over this, I'm sure he'll try to say this is the real reason. Where are you at in this process?

I have hidden and denied my deep love and desire for women all my life. I also married to try to be normal and be accepted by my family and church. I am sealed in the Temple to a wonderful man who loves me so much, but after eight years, I still cannot love him the way he deserves, I also, for the first time in my life, have experienced what it is like to be in love with a real woman, and have that love returned, in nothing more than a kiss, and a simple touch. I now know what love is supposed to feel like. I am slowly coming out to friends and my husband. I feel so trapped, I don't want to hurt him, I do love him in the only way I can. We have no children, and I am forty one now. I want to live my truth, and be free to love the way I was meant to, and who I want to. Why would God hate me so for only wanting to love honestly? How could he despise love at all? I know that my future is going to be filled with both pain and difficulty, but also truth, finally, and maybe even the sweetest most true happiness and love. I was surprised to find so many others in this sort of situation. When you are so hidden you feel like the only one. I thank you for the support and comfort in your words.

In Need of Help
Hi Folks,

This is a member of this wonderful community in need of help big time, so I come begging. Do any of you know where there is a family in need of a live-in Nanny or live-in housekeeper (and no jokes please, okay Marie Osmond could do with one...but who knows her to ask her?) In all seriousness, I have to move out within the next three months and desperately need to find a live-in position. Please if anybody has any ideas or wants to contact me directly for more info, you may do so.
—Mary Mulholland

Family Divided
After coming out to my family, which at that time consisted of a husband of 23 years and 5 children, everything was in an uproar as you can imagine. One of my sons has not spoken to me for the last 5 years. Two married daughters will only have contact with me if I leave my partner home. My one son has finally accepted the new situation as has my youngest who lives at home with me and my partner. Please share with me about your experiences. I am happy in my true life, but am heartsick about the three oldest children.

Sister of Converts to Mormonism
I am the eldest in a family of four. Were were raised in a Baptist church; however, two of my brothers converted to Mormonism recently when they married Mormon women. Generally, we do not discuss the topic of religion when we're together, though I've tried to educate myself on my own regarding their new faith. I have been in the closet all my life, but I have reached the point where I am no longer comfortable doing so. I'm just wondering, how will my siblings and their wives likely react to the news that I am gay based on their religious beliefs? Is it possible that they will now feel it's not appropriate for me to be in contact with my nieces and nephews? I'm just not sure how the Mormon church differs from other religions in this regard. Thanks.

Old and still confused
I'm new here. A brief life story to start. I was never abused as a child to start, and grew up in a good Protestant home. But from Day One, I was a "Tomboy" (I am female, as you guessed). I never felt comfortable with "feminine things, actions, etc., preferring jeans to skirts any day. But I married, had 5 kids, and did what I supposed I should do. But my husband was a pervert eventually, and molested the girls, so I divorced him when I was about 35, which was also about the time I joined the church. During the past 37 years, I fell into some rebound behavior with guys, then remained celibate for a long time until I met a member of my ward whose husband had just left her after many years. We became close friends, and this eventually turned into a sexual relationship, but we were both too guilt ridden to continue, so we went to our Bishop and confessed all, and within a year were again able to take the Sacrament because we stopped our sexual behavior. We did not stop loving each other then, although in the next 5 or 6 years, things deteriorated, and even our friendship ended when she moved away. Since the time we saviour Bishop, I have been celibate again, have served a Stake Mission, teach Gospel Doctrine, and do not feel like a hypocrite because I am not doing, just feeling. I know not everyone can do that, especially when you are younger, but do not think that older people do not have the same needs and passions, maybe just more patience to be able to get by without(Yes, I masturbate, and often).

Is this an easy question, or are there easy answers? Not at all. I firmly believe the church and the Prophets are correct that marriage should be between a man and a woman only, but I have to admit my own tendencies now, especially having once had a same-sex experience (even though short lived). But I go on each day, sometimes fantasizing about having a woman lover and how wonderful it could be, and how much I really would want that, but at the same time, I know what it would do to my family, to my many grandchildren, and my own children. Nor could I face my friends in the ward where I have been a member for over 25 years. I am well liked and respected, but probably the astute ones may suspect that I have never remarried because of this, but most others would probably understand that it is extremely difficult for any single woman over 35-40 to ever find a good man in the church to marry (the good ones are taken by that age), so no one thinks it strange that I am not active in the Singles program. Yes, I suppose I need respect and friends more than I need sex. To be truly loved, however, would be a different thing. I gave that up once, but do not know if I could do that again.

Lesbian Dreams
I was recently baptized, thinking I would be able to "change" myself into a straight woman. It doesn't appear to be that easy!

I wanted to share a dream I had last night, that expresses the issues I have been going through:

I was informed that a woman (from my ward in real life) felt an attraction to me, and I was overjoyed because I shared the same feelings of attraction. I ventured out to meet her, but when I arrived at the house, a man opened the door pretending to be female - He kissed me, and it felt very, very wrong....my heart was filled with sorrow because I was in love with this woman (from my ward), and could not be with her due to this "mixup" with the man (he tricked me into going to his house instead of hers!)

"Love and Acceptance?" Where?
I've recently been learning about the Gospel and a few weeks ago I brought up to the missionaries that I was a lesbian. I really think this is a great church and that the gospel of the Book of Mormon is true, but I also believe that God created us all the way we are, so if we turn out to be gay then why do they try to change us and tell us how sinful it is? I'm going to burn in hell for being the way I am? I can't understand that. People just don't understand that with most lesbians and gays they don't just TURN gay...I know I was born gay, but I just recently (a year ago) came out. And I've always had a hard time dealing with the fact that I'm going to burn in hell for being gay. It's bad enough that we already have enough hatred towards us, now we got people trying to change us or telling us that we are in for Eternal Damnation. I wish that all religions could just accept us. We are out there whether it is sinful or not. We are always going to be out there. Well anyways, I guess I've blabbed enough. Thanks.

Temple Secrets
I was never driven to get all Temple-fied, as I was never that strong into the church. I just can't believe in a church that doesn't believe in me. I can't commit my life to a church that has so many secrets that they are unwilling to share with people who are not "temple worthy." I can't give my heart to a church that believes I must be sealed with a man in order to be a good mother or a worthy woman. It's just wrong. There are things I still love about the church, and would still attend occasionally if I felt welcome there...but I don't, so I won't. It's hard being bought up believe in something, and then when you develop curiosity and want to find answers the church is unwilling to give them to you.

Transgender
For me, as a former transsexual person who now is living as a lesbian woman, the question is: why does the church not accept us, and why do some lesbians have so many problems with people like us? Linda/Germany

Baptism for Children of Lesbian Mothers
I am struggling with the need/want to have my daughter baptized, (she is 9) not to be active in the church but because I believe she has the right and need to be. I am discouraged to do so because why would I want my daughter engaged in a religion that condemns her mother as a lesbian. I cannot get a recommend for her as the intent is not for her to become active. She wants to be baptized to be 'saved' to be 'protected' to receive the Holy Ghost but does not intend to go to church or understand what that means as she only went when she was 5. I am contemplating having her baptized in another church as I feel it is my responsibility to encourage that in my children. I do regret that she will miss out on recieving the spirit and the love I felt as a youth growing up in the church. I have ingnored this issue since she was 8. She will be 10 next month and soon she will make her own choices which may never include baptism at all. I would love a response to my ponderings and struggle.
Jackie